tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post5390070271038700660..comments2024-03-25T07:51:47.758-04:00Comments on Thoughts On Economics: "Undergraduate Economics is a Joke"Robert Vienneauhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14748118392842775431noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-42072555263561682772010-02-04T05:58:50.948-05:002010-02-04T05:58:50.948-05:00Many institutions limit access to their online inf...Many institutions limit access to their online information. Making this information available will be an asset to all.dianna.rose83@gmail.comhttp://www.researchpaperspot.com/undergraduate_research_papers.htmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-51945699755785130492007-11-28T05:20:00.000-05:002007-11-28T05:20:00.000-05:00I just read the whole interview. The quote in this...I just read the whole interview. The quote in this post is a bit cherry picked. The rest is very much worth reading as well. Even or especially for Robert.YouNotSneaky!https://www.blogger.com/profile/06378267534638281151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-30364012418345236042007-11-26T00:33:00.000-05:002007-11-26T00:33:00.000-05:00Yes, not "impolite". Maybe "irreverent". My Englis...Yes, not "impolite". Maybe "irreverent". My English vocabulary (or lack thereof!)<BR/><BR/>I remember emailing a common acquittance, online-speaking, and expressing excitement about that paper. The thought of it being mainstream or not never crossed my mind because it was progress, it was "engaging the issues" constructively.Gabriel Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18020403326536585795noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-37581158223185628752007-11-25T19:34:00.000-05:002007-11-25T19:34:00.000-05:00Thanks for the comments. Other than recognizing th...Thanks for the comments. Other than recognizing that there is nothing impolite in Gintis' statements, I am not too decided one way or the other. It may be helpful to understand Gintis' perspective to recall that he has <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/Game-Theory-Evolving-Herbert-Gintis/dp/0691009430/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1196034510&sr=1-2" REL="nofollow">written</A> a textbook. I have read neither that book nor Kreps' <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/Course-Microeconomic-Theory-David-Kreps/dp/0745007627/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1196034666&sr=1-9" REL="nofollow">textbook</A>, which I understand also proposes a different way of teaching micro.Robert Vienneauhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14748118392842775431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-18693294492906445862007-11-23T16:57:00.000-05:002007-11-23T16:57:00.000-05:00My first-year micro-econ course at the Australian ...My first-year micro-econ course at the Australian National University in Canberra in the late 1970s consisted mainly of natural language statements preceded by the word "Theorem", followed by diagrams preceded by the word "Proof". The best example I remember was:<BR/><BR/>"Theorem: Any intervention by a Government in an economy always leads to a fall in national income."<BR/><BR/>The lecturer prefaced his proof of this outrageous claim by saying, "Imagine a two-person economy, one of whom is the Government." He then drew a diagram, which he claimed was a proof. <BR/><BR/>It was a tough call to determine which group of students were most in despair at this lecturer's ignorance and arrogance -- the pure mathematicians or the political scientists. In either case, you either shut up or you failed the course. <BR/><BR/>And people wonder why I have a low regard for economists . . .Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-77462257973622767662007-11-23T15:21:00.000-05:002007-11-23T15:21:00.000-05:00Along those lines, the general equilibrium model i...Along those lines, the general equilibrium model isn't really taught at undergrad level - much. You might see an Edgeworth box and do a wave-handy proof of 1st Theorem but most of the time you don't go into the nitty gritty. Certainly not gonna go into stability (and of course I tend to disagree with Gintis on this) issues or stuff like that. But the simple reason for this is that it's just too technically complicated. At that point you're still struggling to teach your students what a derivative is and how to transpose a vector.<BR/><BR/>But yeah, I agree with anonymous. There'd be a lot less 'tension' and 'lying' in undergrad teaching if it was more rigorous and technical. Like if Calc 1 was a pre req for Principles and higher Calcs and Linear Algebra were pre reqs for intermediate theory classes. It'd be basically admitting that economics is a technical subject, which everyone already knows. It would also save some misguided students from becoming Econ majors and then realizing that they've got to learn all this math later on.YouNotSneaky!https://www.blogger.com/profile/06378267534638281151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-62429995411681418242007-11-23T14:43:00.000-05:002007-11-23T14:43:00.000-05:00Gintis is simply wrong that in physics new ideas a...Gintis is simply wrong that in physics new ideas are immediately brought to the forefront of the undergraduate curriculum. In fact, much of the undergraduate curriculum is "wrong" in the sense that they are only weak approximations of the real thing. But you have to ease the students in and allow them to build the necessary intellectual machinery.<BR/><BR/>My understanding of economics is that this easing in procedure does not occur. Undergrad is almost completely different that graduate economics. (Although I suspect you are not a fan of graduate-level econ either.) <BR/><BR/>Perhaps they should make the course of study a little more rigorous at the undergrad level.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-26706564.post-87609442929014539712007-11-22T08:52:00.000-05:002007-11-22T08:52:00.000-05:00Is this the same Gintis who wrote The Dynamics of ...Is this the same Gintis who wrote The Dynamics of General Equilibrium? [ http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1017117 ] Funny. He's far more polite and productive there.Gabriel Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18020403326536585795noreply@blogger.com